Comments on: Xforms to the fore? http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/2008/08/26/xforms-to-the-fore/ Tue, 11 Aug 2009 09:53:46 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: Д http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/2008/08/26/xforms-to-the-fore/#comment-86 Д Fri, 22 May 2009 08:39:55 +0000 http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-86 Да тут и добавить то нечего, спасибо всё толково. Да тут и добавить то нечего, спасибо всё толково.

]]> By: Erik Bruchez http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/2008/08/26/xforms-to-the-fore/#comment-18 Erik Bruchez Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:15:58 +0000 http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-18 Hi Dharmesh, I think it is fair to say that XForms requires a learning curve. That is also the price to pay for having an XML-based data model and a pretty smart processing model. This said, the XForms Working Group does have a "simplified syntax" in the works, to lower the barrier to entry. The Working Group's wiki has a section about future features being discussed, if you have any interest: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Forms/wiki/XForms_Future_Features But clearly, defining standards takes time ;-) -Erik Hi Dharmesh,

I think it is fair to say that XForms requires a learning curve. That is also the price to pay for having an XML-based data model and a pretty smart processing model. This said, the XForms Working Group does have a “simplified syntax” in the works, to lower the barrier to entry.

The Working Group’s wiki has a section about future features being discussed, if you have any interest:

http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Forms/wiki/XForms_Future_Features

But clearly, defining standards takes time ;-)

-Erik

]]> By: Dharmesh Mistry http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/2008/08/26/xforms-to-the-fore/#comment-16 Dharmesh Mistry Mon, 01 Sep 2008 08:37:18 +0000 http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-16 Thanks for your post Erik. I am aware that there is a server side rendering option within xForms, and certainly that Orbeon is a great example of that option. I think the challenges that XForms faces (and even the other "standards")is making the standard mass market, which would require the syntactical nature to become accessible to less skilled developers. This is something Steve Pemberton alluded to as the next phase of Xforms at a UK conference at IBM a few years ago. Unfortunately we've seen little progress of that. The base approach of Orbeon is a great idea and edge IPK shares much of the philosphies you do, except we have not tied ourselves in exclusively to xForms. Another challenge is moving xForms into the presentation layer, currently we would charactise it only as a Forms subsegment, and our experience with clients would suggest that this is a key issue. Many forms tend to be parts of complete applications rather than standalone forms and as such have additional issues to cater for example security, menu driven, session data control etc... kind regards - Dharmesh Thanks for your post Erik.

I am aware that there is a server side rendering option within xForms, and certainly that Orbeon is a great example of that option.

I think the challenges that XForms faces (and even the other “standards”)is making the standard mass market, which would require the syntactical nature to become accessible to less skilled developers. This is something Steve Pemberton alluded to as the next phase of Xforms at a UK conference at IBM a few years ago. Unfortunately we’ve seen little progress of that.

The base approach of Orbeon is a great idea and edge IPK shares much of the philosphies you do, except we have not tied ourselves in exclusively to xForms.

Another challenge is moving xForms into the presentation layer, currently we would charactise it only as a Forms subsegment, and our experience with clients would suggest that this is a key issue. Many forms tend to be parts of complete applications rather than standalone forms and as such have additional issues to cater for example security, menu driven, session data control etc…

kind regards – Dharmesh

]]> By: Erik Bruchez http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/2008/08/26/xforms-to-the-fore/#comment-15 Erik Bruchez Wed, 27 Aug 2008 15:35:58 +0000 http://dharmeshmistry.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-15 Hi, Good to see interest in XForms. Luckily, you do not need XForms implemented on the client to use XForms. There are alternatives, including Ajax-based implementations (Orbeon Forms, of which I am a developer), and JavaScript implementations (Ubiquity XForms). Both these examples are entirely open source. BTW I don't think that so far any forms technology has come close to XForms. Web Forms 2.0 / HTML 5 improves on HTML forms, which is great, but 1) this pales in comparison with XForms and 2) this is not available in browsers today either. -Erik Hi,

Good to see interest in XForms.

Luckily, you do not need XForms implemented on the client to use XForms. There are alternatives, including Ajax-based implementations (Orbeon Forms, of which I am a developer), and JavaScript implementations (Ubiquity XForms). Both these examples are entirely open source.

BTW I don’t think that so far any forms technology has come close to XForms. Web Forms 2.0 / HTML 5 improves on HTML forms, which is great, but 1) this pales in comparison with XForms and 2) this is not available in browsers today either.

-Erik

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